Questioning A Swift Boat Veteran For Truth
By Judson Cox (09/01/04)
Judson Cox: Mr. Odell, thank you for granting me this follow up interview. I want to address some of the issues that have been raised since our last interview, nearly a month ago.
How do you explain some of the apparent contradictions by members of the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth? For instance, George Elliott was the commander of your swift boat division. In 1996, Mr. Elliott said that Kerry had acted courageously during his Vietnam service. Another member of your group, Adrian Lonsdale, said (in 1996) that John Kerry showed courage and bravado.
Van Odell: George and Adrian were defending John Kerry against an opponent that called him a war criminal. Kerry, no matter what he said, is not a war criminal. Earlier this year, when “Tour of Duty” came out, they read it and realized it was full of half truths and outright lies. Again, George and Adrian wanted to tell the truth and set the record straight.
JC: The recommendation for Kerry’s Bronze Star says that there were two mine explosions. It says Kerry, "immediately turned his boat around to assist the man in the river, who by this time was receiving sniper fire from the river banks. Throughout the entire action, Lieutenant Junior Grade Kerry proved himself to be calm, professional and highly courageous in the face of enemy fire." You and John Kerry were both there during this incident. You say that there was no enemy fire from either bank. Why should we believe you, but not Sen. Kerry or the after-action reports from March 1969.
VO: The main reason you should believe me is because I was not wounded in the purported intense fire-fight, nor was anyone else, nor were there any bullet holes in the boat. Kerry has changed his story several times. On the floor of the Senate, he said a mine went off underneath his boat and lifted it 2 feet. Then, he said it happened close aboard and blew Rassman off the boat. But, during the eulogy for Tom Belladou he said Rassman fell off when he made a sharp turn. Rassman said, (in “Tour of Duty”) that he fell off while eating a cookie, when the boat took off. Kerry tells many stories about that day, we tell only one.
JC: Larry Thurlow, another member of your group, also received a Bronze Star for his actions during this incident. His citation also says there was enemy fire. Why did Mr. Thurlow accept this medal if, as he says now, there was no hostile fire?
VO: He thought it was for saving the 3 boat and tending to the wounded. He has said that if it was predicated on hostile fire, he would give it back.
JC: Why is there not a single document from 1969 to corroborate your story?
VO: The Spot report was false, and all documents that spring from the spot report are false. Kerry authored the spot report. We have seven eye witnesses who dispute Kerry’s account.
JC: The Swift Boat Veterans for Truth’s new advertisement plays audio of Kerry’s testimony before Congress in 1971. He testified that US soldiers committed widespread, systematic atrocities and war crimes in Vietnam that this was US policy. Is this true?
VO: NO, NO, NO. I never saw, heard or participated in war crimes. If Kerry saw such crimes he was required to report them as a naval officer.
JC: Kerry’s spokesman, John Hurley, says that Kerry did not overstate reports of atrocities in Vietnam, and that he stands by his testimony even today. He says that Sen. Kerry is a leader who exposed systematic atrocities that were part of President Nixon’s policies in fighting an immoral, unnecessary and failed war. Do you believe that the Vietnam War was immoral, unnecessary and failing at that time?
VO: NO, the failure started when men like John Kerry lied about war crimes while we still had men in the field and in prisoner of war camps. It was immoral to abandon those men, and it was immoral to pull our forces out without victory. After we left, millions of the people we had been protecting were slaughtered by the communists.
JC: Hurly also claims that Kerry “honors the service of veterans who served in Vietnam. He came back and he fought for them. He fought to save lives.” Do you believe that Kerry saved the lives of American soldiers and fought for them?
VO: John Kerry has only fought for himself. He has used veterans for his own selfish needs.
JC: The Kerry campaign says that your group is a front for the White House and is doing its dirty work. Bob Perry is a well known Texas Republican, and a close associate of Karl Rove. Merrie Spaeth has been working for Republican causes for years. Perry has been a large contributor to the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth, and Spaeth is a public relations consultant for your group. Why should we not conclude that the Swift Boat Veterans are a Republican front group given these ties?
VO: You can name all sorts of Republicans, but they are not connected with our message. The US Navy did not send Republicans to Viet Nam, they sent men. We are Democrats, Republicans and Independents who earned the right of freedom of speech with our blood and service in Viet Nam, and we will not be silenced.
JC: Former Senator Max Cleland and Sen. John McCain have publicly demanded that President Bush denounce the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth. They also demand that he order your group to stop your political activities. If President Bush were to do this, would you stop your public criticisms of Sen. Kerry, and give up your freedom of speech?
VO: NO WAY!
JC: McCain and Cleland claim to speak for America’s veterans, specifically those who served in Vietnam. To your knowledge, have Vietnam veterans ever elected them as your spokesmen?
VO: These gentlemen do not speak for veterans, they speak for themselves. Veterans are individuals, and self proclaimed spokesmen do not speak for all veterans.
Again, thank you Mr. Odell for your time and your service to our country.
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